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Post by risman on Jul 8, 2022 10:11:44 GMT -5
I have a Dell XPS 13 9350 running Win 10 64-bit, 19043.1806, fully updated. SFC shows no problems. Chkdsk shows no problems. Windows Memory Diagnostic Tool shows no problems. Event log shows BSOD occurs approximately every 34-35 minutes, with stopcode Reference by Pointer, caused by driver ntoskrnl.exe Any ideas as to what's causing this and how to correct it?
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drcard
Software Review Panel
Posts: 580
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Post by drcard on Jul 8, 2022 14:00:58 GMT -5
Hi risman,
The ntoskrnl.exe driver is the one that runs the NT Windows Kernel. You have performed some very good testing.
Other possibilities: This can be caused by overclocking the CPU or the CPU can be overheating. Does your system keep temp on the CPU (like in BIOS)?
Did this start with your last Windows Update (a bad update install can cause this)? BTW 19043.1806 is not the current update version. Current update version is 19044.1766.
Also, malware can cause this.
Check to make sure your drivers are up to date
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Post by risman on Jul 8, 2022 18:22:48 GMT -5
I ran memtest86 and found no errors after 4 runs. It showed Min/Max/Avg temps of 54C/83C/71C. I don't know exactly when or why this started. It's my wife's laptop. It first happened in Peru about 3 weeks ago, but didn't immediately follow a Windows update. One problem seems to be that I can't update Windows to latest version. So far I've tried every step to force an update listed in helpdeskgeek.com/windows-10/how-to-force-windows-10-to-install-an-update/. On the last step, using Windows Update Assistant, it got to about 80%+ of installing and then BSOD with same stop code occurred again. I'm now trying the update assistant again. As far as I know, all drivers are up to date and no malware has been detected.
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Post by risman on Jul 8, 2022 18:43:08 GMT -5
Got up to 85% of install before BSOD this time. Going to try in safe mode.
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Post by risman on Jul 8, 2022 18:58:31 GMT -5
Can't update in safe mode.
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drcard
Software Review Panel
Posts: 580
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Post by drcard on Jul 8, 2022 19:42:16 GMT -5
Hi risman,
CPU temps over 74 °C will cause the CPU to shut down to prevent damage (BSOD at kernel level). A high of 83 and an average of 71 indicates the CPU is overheating.
There can be many reason for the high temp....CPU fan quick working, vents to external ports clogged, dried up thermal paste of CPU to heat sink, etc.
Laptops are very hard to work on and take special knowledge just to open without breaking something.
The more times a CPU shuts down due to heat, the more prone for the CPU to shut down and will become unstable.
Choices are:
Have a pro look at it (get an estimate first to decide if the laptop is worth fixing - may need a new CPU).
Get a cool pad for the laptop which may help with the heat enough to keep it running.
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Post by risman on Jul 9, 2022 13:16:22 GMT -5
Fan doesn't seem to be working. Will try replacing it.
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Post by MarkRH on Jul 9, 2022 21:09:09 GMT -5
Way back the fan quit working on my CPU. Until I could get it replaced, I left the case open and if needed aimed an outside fan at it.
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Post by risman on Jul 12, 2022 9:22:59 GMT -5
Replacement fan doesn't start either. What could cause this?
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drcard
Software Review Panel
Posts: 580
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Post by drcard on Jul 13, 2022 10:15:03 GMT -5
Hi risman,
Try the items below in order given until you fix or find out more info.
Make sure no connection wires stop the fan blades from turning.
Make sure do do a full shudown and cold start. A full shutdown is to hold down the Shift key while pressing the Shutdown button on the screen with the mouse pointer.
Reset BIOS to default values (establishes new connections to motherboard that controls the fan).
Measure the voltage of the CPU fan connector when the fan is should be on. If no voltage to the fan, it could be the connector, the motherboard, or on some systems the power supply has separate outputs for fans and that portion of the power supply is not working.
Hope the resets are the fix as no voltage from the leads means a larger problem ...Motherboard or power supply.
Let me know if I can help more.
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Post by risman on Jul 13, 2022 12:51:56 GMT -5
Reset BIOS. No change. How do I tell which terminals of the fan connector to check?
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drcard
Software Review Panel
Posts: 580
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Post by drcard on Jul 13, 2022 13:46:34 GMT -5
Hi risman,
The connector that the fan connects to in the laptop has two wires. One is + and the other is - The voltage will be DC and about 5 volts. Set the meter to DC. Place the tip of each probe inside the connector from the motherboard so the tip contacts the metal inside the connector. One probe for each side . If the meter appears to go neg or not move, switch the probes as you may have the polarity switched. Usually the side of the connector from the red wire is +. Make sure you're measuring when the cpu fan should be running and the probes are making contact. A trick I used is to cut the wires with the connector that would connect to the motherboard off an old non-working fan. Connect the connector to the PC connection and the lose wires can be easily and securely connected to for measuring voltages.
If no voltage when there should be means bad motherboard or power supply depending upon the how the laptop is setup.
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Post by risman on Jul 13, 2022 14:57:09 GMT -5
My fan connector has 4 wires (that's why I asked). I assumed red and black would be +/- and that's what I tested but there's also a blue & yellow wire. Another question is when should the fan be running? I figured it would run when first turned on, but maybe not? Does CPU have to be stressed?
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drcard
Software Review Panel
Posts: 580
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Post by drcard on Jul 13, 2022 15:28:43 GMT -5
Hi risman,
The yellow wire is usually a sensing wire such as seeing it on or measuring the RPMs. The blue is usually a power management sensor.
The blue wire if is used by your laptop could be software from keeping the fan from coming on until needed. Also the correct replacement fan must be used so the sensor can turn the fan on.
Have you tested with the new fan to see if you get over heated in that time frame it was shutting down before? Maybe the fan will turn on when it heats up.
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Post by risman on Jul 14, 2022 12:01:29 GMT -5
Strange things are happening. More background: The BSOD issue happened on my wife's Dell XPS 13 9350 laptop, running Win10 64-bit. Every time I tried to update Windows, I'd get the BSOD. I thought it was overheating and the fan wasn't running, so tried replacing the fan, but the new fan didn't run either. My own laptop is a newer Dell XPS 13 9380. As my wife needs her laptop more often than I need mine, I swapped the SSD card from her laptop into my newer one. I still couldn't get that laptop to download the latest Win 10 version, but managed to install Win 11 on it. She's using it now with no apparent problems thus far. Meanwhile, I put the SSD card from my laptop into hers. And, since the new fan wasn't running, I figured there was some more serious issue going on, so removed the new fan to return it, and put the old fan back in. And now the fan is running, the laptop ran with no BSOD for over an hour, and I just was able to download the 2022-07 cumulative 21H2 update with no problems. Bizarre!
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